Postage overcharging?

[tinmoldova]

I think that Ebay and Paypal bear some blame with this phenomenon. A seller knows that for each $20 sold, a buyer utilizing Paypal (an extremely common payment method for international bidders) is costing the seller about $1 in fees. Thus, if a seller parts with a relatively common order, like the Order of Red Banner, for $60 and charges $3 for Shipping/Handling worldwide, a seller would be forced to utilize cash from the base bid to cover even the low costs of a bubble mailer via first class mail in the US since the $3 S/H would go toward covering the Ebay/Paypal fees (and $3 may not cover all of the fees)--it would be even worse for international postage.

To overcome this, sellers, it seems, may tend to overcorrect by inflating S/H fees since it is safer to initially protect against being shortchanged on larger lots. I have heard that some bidders (international and domestic), when told, will forward additional money if their postage costs are more than those listed in the item description--but not all. Additionally, who has a postage scale in their house? Most, I would contend, can only guesstimate at the approximate weight of a heavier lot like a tunic or uniform or a sizable medal lot. For international lots, the difference of a kilogram could translate into some serious coin. Make no doubt about it, I think the excessive flat fees discussed in earlier posts is quite wrong, but I understand how a seller would raise his fees to cover increased costs.

When bidding on EBay, I look at the total cost of the item--including S/H--in determining whether to bid on an item and at what amount. We all pay taxes on other purchases, and I think S/H fees bear closest analogy to federal/state/VAT taxes. We understand that the price tag on the can of corn on the shelf in my local grocer is not the final cost for that can of corn! I won't bid on items where the shipping/handling fees are clearly outlined, but won't fret over a couple of bucks if my Ebay purchase arrives safely, timely, and as described.

[paddywhack]

i normaly buy straight off of collecters and normal i pay the actule shipping cost but there was one time where i bought 3 kriesmarine knights cross winner signed pictures that also came with frames and i had to pay shipping of 30 euros!!!but i realy want the pics so i payed it! but what did annoy me was that id bought a full tunic boots and all(american!) and the shipping was 10 dollars!!!! but what is great at the moment with the dollar as has been said before is that with the dollar exchange rate as it is its paying for its own shipping most times! which is great!!!!

[Tretov]

A russian seller on eBay (appears under a new name every 6 months, probably he gets banned and have to get a new user ID) use another delicate way to make cash. He sells items (Gvardia badges, posters, general junk) for prices like 0.99 USD etc. and charges 10-20 USD for "Postal+Handling+CUSTOMS". Plus, if you want to pay by bank, you have to add 5 USD.

I can't say for sure, but I have never had to pay a "customs fee" to any other seller/dealer in Russia but to this guy. The postage for the items is usually not more than a few bucks. And about the bank fee he asks for - I use the same bank as he, and the bank almost never charge the beneficiary any fee, it is the sender of the money that have to pay the fees.

Finally, the same guys sell electronic copies of Soviet instruction books, like 1959 uniform rules. You never get these "in paper", you have to download them from a server. The initial cost (auction bid) is 99 cents, then there is a 3 USD handling fee PLUS the 5 USD bank fee. (See above)

To bring an old thread back to the surface...

The same **** again. The auction (for one soviet order, the second highest on suspension) states a flat rate shipping of 9 USD, presumably world-wide. When I receive the invoice from the seller the postage has grown to 21 USD (now we are talking big buck) but a written text in the mail states 16 USD. The way of shipping is USPS Flat Rate Global Priority. On ALL the Flat Rate letters (not the boxes) I have received during the last years, the postage has been 5 USD, not more, not less.

I'm getting sick and tired of this, and I have decided, that if this person keeps asking for this extreme shipping, and I find that it was lower (the USPS has the nice habit of stamping the cost on a sticker) I will give him negative feedback for postage overcharging. I have had enough!

[Dolf]

Tretov,

Why don't you talk with the seller before bidding and ask all your questions, clarifying the shipping costs and methods?
No one ever overcharged me in shipping costs because I clarify that before, so when the bill comes there are no surprises!
Just a piece of an advice...

Dolf

[dannybou]

I also understand the frustrations. And when I saw the $30 USD shipping charges of one dealer site to anywhere outside the US, including Canada!!!! well I had to email them and request a confirmation that it wasn't a typo. And it wasn't. Not only did they confirm the amount, but advised they were ready to receive my order. Needless to say that THAT will never happen!!

[Tretov]

Originally Posted by Dolf

Tretov,

Why don't you talk with the seller before bidding and ask all your questions, clarifying the shipping costs and methods?
No one ever overcharged me in shipping costs because I clarify that before, so when the bill comes there are no surprises!
Just a piece of an advice...

Dolf

I was prepared for 9 USD, but not 21 USD. Even though 9 USD is too much I can still accept it.


Edit:

Having negotiated with the person, the cost became 12 USD, then dropped to 7 USD, then he changed to 8 USD and then to 5 USD when I sent him a photo of a recently recieved letter with 5 USD shipping sticker. For USPS Global Priority Flat Rate. Hmmm...

[Lapa]

Guys,

Since we are at it, I got a lot of 8 low end badges a while back (dated winner of socialist competition mostly). Ending bid: $4.50. Then I received an email from the seller congratulating me on my "valuable win of rare and valuable Soviet badges" and requesting payment for a grand total of $16.50 ($12 shipping for 8 light aluminum badges). I went back to him regarding shipping costs, and sure enough he confirmed that it was the price because he was sending "a well packed package in which each badge had been carefully and individually wrapped", that he decided to ship it this way, and that it was not to be argued with. I must say that regular USPS air mailing based upon weight amounted to something like $3 or so; I also mentioned the flat-rate Global Priority envelope for $6.
I received a very creative answer to that; in substance, he was dropping his mail fee to either $3 or $6, but regretfully had to charge me a handling fee of respectively $9 or $6 (depending on which mailing option I was choosing!). Anyway, to make a long story short, he must have valued his feedback rating enough to simply "let go" of this transaction, as I made it clear that his approach was nothing short of highway robbery.

One legal point I'd like to bring up here about shipping charges and the like: the law says that the seller retains title to the goods until payment FOR THOSE GOODS is effected and the seller has received such payment; once the seller has received his payment, legal title to the goods passes to the buyer, even if these goods are still in the custody of the buyer. Technically speaking, as legal owner of the goods, the buyer is therefore free to choose his preferred method of shipping, the seller being at this stage merely the temporary custodian of the goods and having a legal obligation to comply with the legal owner's desires and wishes with respect to these goods.
What this means practically is that, once payment has been received by the seller, he has no legal grounds to impose one shipping way over another to the buyer, regardless of whatever arguments he may put forward. One small nuance here is needed however: in some cases, the seller could request that he be compensated for the actual extra time he spent fulfilling the buyer's preference for shipment over the time he would have spent shipping it his preferred way; but then, he would have to document the whole process, and would probably spend more time requesting the compensation than it would actually be worth.

Hope this helps, I have successfully used this legal argumentation a few times, and got the goods shipped the way I wanted.

Marc

[Christophe]

Marc,

Excellent point !!!

As far as today, I never had to experiment such a problem, buying only to respectable dealers or sellers with reasonable shipping costs.
But I cautiously keep the argument, just in case of...

Cheers.

Ch.

[Art]

Marc,

Good for you! People have to stand up to these unscrupulous businessmen, and I applaud your steadfastness. The "handling" fee is nothing but a way for the seller to pad his profit margin. Some people argue it's necessary because of all the "time and cost" spent packing and driving the package to the post office. Big Deal! My opinion is if you don't want to do it, then don't.

Another aggravation I have with dealing with these small time entrepreneurs on EBay are shipping times. I'll buy a DVD or something else small, pay priority shipping ( for those in U.S., priority is around 3 days ) then the lazy seller won't ship for 5 days. It's even more annoying when the guy emails you and says that he shipped the package, and when you receive it 5-10 days later, it is postmarked 2 days ago

[dannybou]

Speaking of shipping, lately I've been annoyed at shipping times. I have ordered medals from the US, sent regular mail and some take 5 days to reach me, but others take a bloody month!! I have received goods from the UK and Ukraine in a week, I just don't understand the postal service. I'm also one to ask before bidding for the shipping charges. If they are too high either he lowers them to what it should be or I don't buy.