Marshal of Soviet Union uniform - Page 2

Tal Inbar · 10-07-2003, 05:40 PM

Are N O T HSL.

Tal

skipper1939 · 10-08-2003, 07:33 AM

The last posted star is indeed not a "serp i molot." I was referring to the one on the very first uniform which is indeed an HSU. That's what makes it look "fat." The others (very fat) are unknown to me and one looks like the "internationalist" medal from the Afghan war.

The stars and badges on the right breast are surely positioned in a somewhat random pattern. The staff academy diamond was always the wild card and often placed to balance the pattern, but the whole things was supposed to start at 70mm from the longest lapel.

I would not acquire any of them, although the navy tunic is fascinating.

Dr. Bob Clawson, emeritus professor of Soviet military studies.

Tal Inbar · 10-08-2003, 07:49 AM

Sorry, It IS the same star....there is no HSU nor HSL star in this thread.

Tal

otlichnik · 10-08-2003, 09:56 AM

Bob,

The stars on the top two uniforms are the same. Tal digitally enhanced the top one. It is either a fantasy item or a copy of some East European hero type star.

The "awards" on the right breasts of these uniforms are also (with the exception of the odd academy badge, guards badge and one half hidden fake (?) Nevsky) fantasy items and/or veteran's badges. The stuff selling for $5 or less in Russia.

We have had the debate on what these are for quite a while. All M69 uniforms up to the top rank are still being made today for sale in Ukraine in an old uniform factory from (mostly) genuine materials. They are thus very hard to tell from the genuine. In Russia it is thought that many of these are actually old original unissued stock, although there is some evidence they too are being made in Russia or shipped Ukraine to Russia.

So many are fakes or maybe better yet post-Soviet production copies. As yo rightly note the big danger is when (usually) they are sold as the genuine Soviet puppy.

The sad thing is that original and genuine examples of all of this are available. While there is far less of it and not everyone can get one and you would have to wait a bit in many cases - ironically the genuine is often not much more than the "fake" - at least those offered on Ebay.

I shudder to think how many people are out tere who have paid $500 plus for what was sold them as an original item.

Shawn

Esteban_cool · 10-10-2003, 08:01 PM

But I have seen this star(or at least very similar to it)in cosmonaut´s awards...Take a look on Tereshkova´s "Hero stars"
It is not HSL neither, with, "something" in the middle of the star.
The medal at the last.

Dave · 10-10-2003, 08:22 PM

Good point about Tereshkova's star.. I don't know what it is, but it's definately Warsaw Pact, and it definately ISN'T Soviet!!!

--Dave

Esteban_cool · 10-10-2003, 08:29 PM

What a quick answer! ^_^
I was concerned about it. Not HSL, with the Bulgarian Hero and the other one...Which is that other Hero-kind medal?

Dave · 10-10-2003, 08:35 PM

Looking through my stuff... It's not Bulgarian, it's not Yugoslavian... Did Mongolia have their star that looked something like this? Anyone have a pic of the medal for "Hero of Czechoslovakia"?

--Dave

Christophe · 10-11-2003, 04:11 AM

Just to say that Valentina Tereshkova has the rank of 'Hero of Socialist Labour of Czechoslovakia', and not of "Hero of Czechoslovakia".

On this pic of Jurij Gagarin and Valentina Tereshkova you can see a better pic of this unknown star, as both of them have been awarded with the same 4 stars.

where we know, thanks to Ed Haynes, that the triangular-red-ribboned star with the gold suspension bar is Czech, Zlatá hvìzda hrdiny socialistické práce / Gold Star of the Hero of Socialist Labour of Czechoslovakia.

Knowing also that Valentina Tereshkova has the rank of Hero of Socialist Labour of the People's Republic of Bulgaria, this star could be the third one :

And as Valentina tereshkova was also a Hero of Labour of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam, the 4th and unknown one could be the Gold Star of the Hero of Labour of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam.

This star shows a similar shape to many North Vietnam awards.

If anyone has a pic of this Gold Star ?

For comparison, look at the shape of the North Vietnam star of the Soldier of Liberation Order, 3rd Class :

The North Vietnam stars looks all very similar.

Ch.

Christophe · 10-11-2003, 04:11 AM

Just to say that Valentina Tereshkova has the rank of 'Hero of Socialist Labour of Czechoslovakia', and not of "Hero of Czechoslovakia".

On this pic of Jurij Gagarin and Valentina Tereshkova you can see a better pic of this unknown star, as both of them have been awarded with the same 4 stars.

where we know, thanks to Ed Haynes, that the triangular-red-ribboned star with the gold suspension bar is Czech, Zlatá hvìzda hrdiny socialistické práce / Gold Star of the Hero of Socialist Labour of Czechoslovakia.

Knowing also that Valentina Tereshkova has the rank of Hero of Socialist Labour of the People's Republic of Bulgaria, this star could be the third one :

And as Valentina tereshkova was also a Hero of Labour of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam, the 4th and unknown one could be the Gold Star of the Hero of Labour of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam.

This star shows a similar shape to many North Vietnam awards.

If anyone has a pic of this Gold Star ?

For comparison, look at the shape of the North Vietnam star of the Soldier of Liberation Order, 3rd Class :

The North Vietnam stars looks all very similar.

Ch.

10-08-2003, 07:49 AM	#13
Tal Inbar Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Israel Age: 55 Posts: 2,302	Sorry, It IS the same star....there is no HSU nor HSL star in this thread. Tal __________________ Under the banner of Marxism-Leninism, under the leadership of the Communist Party--forward to new victories in the construction of communism!

10-10-2003, 08:29 PM	#17
Esteban_cool Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Santiago, Chile Age: 36 Posts: 1,103	What a quick answer! ^_^ I was concerned about it. Not HSL, with the Bulgarian Hero and the other one...Which is that other Hero-kind medal? __________________ There's nothing in the streets Looks any different to me And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye And the parting on the left Are now parting on the right And the beards have all grown longer overnight The Who, Won't get fooled again

10-10-2003, 08:35 PM	#18
Dave Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: California Age: 49 Posts: 700	Looking through my stuff... It's not Bulgarian, it's not Yugoslavian... Did Mongolia have their star that looked something like this? Anyone have a pic of the medal for "Hero of Czechoslovakia"? --Dave Last edited by Dave; 10-10-2003 at 08:39 PM.

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10-08-2003, 07:33 AM	#12
skipper1939 Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent, Ohio - USA Age: 84 Posts: 61	The last posted star is indeed not a "serp i molot." I was referring to the one on the very first uniform which is indeed an HSU. That's what makes it look "fat." The others (very fat) are unknown to me and one looks like the "internationalist" medal from the Afghan war. The stars and badges on the right breast are surely positioned in a somewhat random pattern. The staff academy diamond was always the wild card and often placed to balance the pattern, but the whole things was supposed to start at 70mm from the longest lapel. I would not acquire any of them, although the navy tunic is fascinating. Dr. Bob Clawson, emeritus professor of Soviet military studies.

10-08-2003, 09:56 AM	#14
otlichnik Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Age: 56 Posts: 547	Bob, The stars on the top two uniforms are the same. Tal digitally enhanced the top one. It is either a fantasy item or a copy of some East European hero type star. The "awards" on the right breasts of these uniforms are also (with the exception of the odd academy badge, guards badge and one half hidden fake (?) Nevsky) fantasy items and/or veteran's badges. The stuff selling for $5 or less in Russia. We have had the debate on what these are for quite a while. All M69 uniforms up to the top rank are still being made today for sale in Ukraine in an old uniform factory from (mostly) genuine materials. They are thus very hard to tell from the genuine. In Russia it is thought that many of these are actually old original unissued stock, although there is some evidence they too are being made in Russia or shipped Ukraine to Russia. So many are fakes or maybe better yet post-Soviet production copies. As yo rightly note the big danger is when (usually) they are sold as the genuine Soviet puppy. The sad thing is that original and genuine examples of all of this are available. While there is far less of it and not everyone can get one and you would have to wait a bit in many cases - ironically the genuine is often not much more than the "fake" - at least those offered on Ebay. I shudder to think how many people are out tere who have paid $500 plus for what was sold them as an original item. Shawn

10-10-2003, 08:22 PM	#16
Dave Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: California Age: 49 Posts: 700	Good point about Tereshkova's star.. I don't know what it is, but it's definately Warsaw Pact, and it definately ISN'T Soviet!!! --Dave

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