Medal "For Bravery".

[matthijs]

150 Euro for the ORBL, Lenningrad medal and the Bravery medal

[desantnik]

You're free to buy it, but you would be paying way too much money.

[Censlenov]

Looks to me as though the thing circled in Red is the partially rubbed out number 9. I think she's been erased and renumbered. I'm new to this collecting area but even i wouldn't touch it.

Cheers
Chris

Originally Posted by matthijs

I hope this helps. Thanks for your fast respons Marc:thumbsup

Compare to the numbering on these 2 which i believe are authentic:thumbsup

[Nota Bene]

Originally Posted by Censlenov

Looks to me as though the thing circled in Red is the partially rubbed out number 9. I think she's been erased and renumbered. I'm new to this collecting area but even i wouldn't touch it.

Cheers
Chris

Chris,

That's true, but we were discussing a possibility that it was done by the mint, which I do not believe.

Alexei

[Alfred]

Hello,

how many of these U shaped Bravery Medals were produced/awarded?

According to Mondvor they appear in the serial number range between minimum 2.864.684 and maximum 3.654.953. That would be around 800.000 pieces.

But in these serial number range are also a lot of Bravery Medals with separate soldered ring.
You see these u shaped medals not so often.

What is your observation?

My observation - s/n:

Start: 2.864.684 Mondvor

2.801.954 - separate soldered ring
2.803.256 - separate soldered ring
2.803.327 - separate soldered ring
2.837.678 - separate soldered ring
2.839.579 - separate soldered ring
2.840.437 - separate soldered ring
2.840.765 - separate soldered ring
2.845.460 - separate soldered ring
2.848.290 - separate soldered ring
2.849.927 - separate soldered ring
2.853.713 - separate soldered ring
2.858.867 - separate soldered ring
2.859.286 - separate soldered ring
2.860.053 - separate soldered ring
2.864.684 - U shaped ring
2.865.101 - separate soldered ring
2.873.673 - separate soldered ring
2.879.947 - separate soldered ring
2.892.016 - separate soldered ring
2.899.077 - separate soldered ring
2.910.399 - separate soldered ring
2.911.814 - separate soldered ring
2.934.953 - separate soldered ring
2.935.158 - separate soldered ring
2.935.668 - separate soldered ring
2.935.803 - separate soldered ring
2.936.624 - separate soldered ring
2.949.133 - separate soldered ring
2.970.318 - separate soldered ring
2.971.215 - separate soldered ring
2.971.768 - separate soldered ring
2.971.940 - separate soldered ring
2.972.568 - separate soldered ring
2.972.591 - separate soldered ring
2.972.891 - separate soldered ring
2.973.393 - separate soldered ring
2.973.398 - separate soldered ring
2.973.492 - U-shaped ring
2.973.543 - separate soldered ring
2.973.644 - separate soldered ring
2.974.294 - separate soldered ring
2.986.193 - separate soldered ring
2.986.935 - separate soldered ring
2.987.056 - separate soldered ring
2.987.572 - separate soldered ring
2.991.662 - separate soldered ring
3.005.519 - separate soldered ring
3.014.455 - separate soldered ring
3.019.113 - separate soldered ring
3.019.399 - separate soldered ring
3.025.404 - separate soldered ring
3.029.845 - separate soldered ring
3.046.978 - separate soldered ring
3.048.217 - separate soldered ring
3.048.438 - separate soldered ring
3.050.444 - separate soldered ring
3.052.678 - separate soldered ring
3.054.766 - separate soldered ring
3.059.538 - separate soldered ring
3.059.941 - separate soldered ring
3.064.258 - separate soldered ring
3.067.754 - separate soldered ring
3.071.392 - separate soldered ring
3.086.076 - U shaped ring
3.086.410 - U shaped ring
3.086.881 - separate soldered ring
3.092.985 - U shaped ring
3.097.542 - separate soldered ring
3.102.171 - separate soldered ring
3.113.489 - separate soldered ring
3.117.598 - separate soldered ring
3.123.911 - separate soldered ring
3.124.046 - separate soldered ring
3.127.948 - separate soldered ring
3.133.237 - separate soldered ring
3.144.320 - separate soldered ring
3.146.588 - separate soldered ring
3.148.539 - separate soldered ring
3.153.510 - separate soldered ring
3.155.786 - separate soldered ring
3.155.789 - separate soldered ring
3.156.741 - separate soldered ring
3.157.246 - separate soldered ring
3.159.572 - separate soldered ring
3.165.440 - separate soldered ring
3.168.372 - separate soldered ring
3.172.449 - separate soldered ring
3.177.243 - separate soldered ring
3.181.004 - separate soldered ring
3.181.646 - separate soldered ring
3.183.536 - separate soldered ring
3.187.678 - separate soldered ring
3.190.017 - separate soldered ring
3.202.828 - separate soldered ring
3.211.505 - separate soldered ring
3.212.469 - separate soldered ring
3.214.614 - separate soldered ring
3.220.236 - separate soldered ring
3.220.635 - separate soldered ring
3.225.796 - separate soldered ring
3.228.889 - separate soldered ring
3.325.951 - separate soldered ring
3.232.474 - separate soldered ring
3.234.443 - separate soldered ring
3.243.087 - separate soldered ring
3.246.894 - separate soldered ring
3.251.082 - separate soldered ring
3.252.057 - separate soldered ring
3.253.176 - separate soldered ring
3.260.246 - separate soldered ring
3.260.961 - separate soldered ring
3.269.295 - separate soldered ring
3.269.484 - separate soldered ring
3.270.097 - separate soldered ring
3.270.689 - separate soldered ring
3.270.798 - separate soldered ring
3.272.072 - separate soldered ring
3.276.292 - separate soldered ring
3.276.412 - separate soldered ring
3.276.745 - separate soldered ring
3.276.757 - separate soldered ring
3.276.804 - separate soldered ring
3.276.926 - separate soldered ring
3.278.146 - separate soldered ring
3.290.089 - separate Soldered ring
3.315.092 - separate soldered ring
3.315.568 - separate soldered ring
3.317.094 - separate soldered ring
3.317.321 - separate soldered ring
3.320.882 - separate soldered ring
3.332.037 - separate soldered ring
3.332.496 - separate soldered ring
3.333.641 - separate soldered ring
3.342.135 - separate soldered ring
3.348.113 - separate soldered ring
3.348.884 - separate soldered ring
3.365.117 - U shaped ring
3.375.335 - U shaped ring
3.385.096 - separate soldered ring
3.385.341 - U shaped ring
3.387.773 - separate soldered ring
3.389.556 - separate soldered ring
3.389.803 - U shaped ring
3.391.803 - U shaped ring
3.393.225 - U shaped ring
3.393.226 - U shaped ring
3.396.936 - separate soldered ring
3.397.744 - U shaped ring
3.397.842 - separate soldered ring
3.389.633 - U-shaped ring
3.398.128 - U shaped ring
3.399.135 - separate soldered ring
3.399.164 - separate soldered ring
3.399.183 - separate soldered ring
3.399.584 - U shaped ring
3.401.851 - U shaped ring
3.402.113 - U shaped ring
3.414.462 - U-shaped ring
3.419.161 - U shaped ring
3.425.487 - separate soldered ring
3.426.478 - separate soldered ring
3.426.894 - separate soldered ring
3.427.977 - separate soldered ring
3.428.312 - separate soldered ring
3.429.622 - separate soldered ring
3.433.661 - separate soldered ring
3.434.044 - separate soldered ring
3.434.045 - U shaped ring
3.437.902 - U shaped ring
3.439.972 - separate soldered ring
3.443,429 - U shaped ring
3.452.253 - U shaped ring
3.452.440 - separate soldered ring
3.454.214 - U shaped ring
3.457.808 - separate soldered ring
3.464.068 - separate soldered ring
3.464.310 - separate soldered ring
3.469.170 - U shaped ring
3.470.093 - U shaped ring
3.471.539 - U shaped ring
3.472.486 - U shaped ring
3.474.194 - U shaped ring
3.474.608 - U-shaped ring
3.474.842 - U shaped ring
3.474.876 - separate soldered ring
3.476.492 - U shaped ring
3.479.093 - U shaped ring
3.480.419 - separate soldered ring
3.485.633 - U shaped ring
3.496.322 - separate soldered ring
3.499.125 - separate soldered ring
3.501.660 - separate soldered ring
3.502.571 - separate soldered ring
3.506.738 - separate soldered ring
3.508.147 - separate soldered ring
3.508.562 - separate soldered ring
3.511.327 - separate soldered ring
3.511.399 - separate soldered ring
3.511.731 - separate soldered ring
3.514.451 - separate soldered ring
3.519.357 - separate soldered ring
3.519.358 - separate soldered ring
3.520.375 - separate soldered ring
3.522.633 - separate soldered ring
3.523.481 - separate soldered ring
3.523.490 - U shaped ring
3.526.623 - separate soldered ring
3.530.674 - separate soldered ring
3.534.913 - separate soldered ring
3.534.991 - separate soldered ring
3.535.046 - separate soldered ring
3.546.853 - separate soldered ring
3.554.646 - separate soldered ring
3.554.871 - separate soldered ring
3.554.893 - separate soldered ring
3.554.910 - separate soldered ring
3.555.516 - separate soldered ring
3.560.518 - separate soldered ring
3.560.849 - separate soldered ring
3.563.105 - separate soldered ring
3.566.444 - U shaped ring
3.568.473 - separate soldered ring
3.576.256 - separate soldered ring
3.576.367 - U-shaped ring
3.578.151 - separate soldered ring
3.580.543 - U shaped ring
3.580.547 - U shaped ring
3.583.162 - U shaped ring
3.585.676 - U shaped ring
3.587.047 - U shaped ring
3.587.382 - U shaped ring
3.589.444 - separate soldered ring
3.591.341 - U shaped ring
3.603.238 - U-shaped ring
3.605.102 - separate soldered ring
3.605.916 - separate soldered ring
3.605.946 - separate soldered ring
3.605.961 - separate soldered ring
3.605.973 - separate soldered ring
3.606.182 - separate soldered ring
3.606.367 - separate soldered ring
3.606.468 - separate soldered ring
3.606.471 - separate soldered ring
3.606.473 - U shaped ring
3.606.481 - separate soldered ring
3.606.486 - separate soldered ring
3.606.558 - separate soldered ring
3.606.571 - separate soldered ring
3.606.670 - U shaped ring
3.606.763 - separate soldered ring
3.606.765 - separate soldered ring
3.606.820 - separate soldered ring
3.607.089 - separate soldered ring
3.607.389 - separate soldered ring
3.609.779 - separate soldered ring
3.611.909 - separate soldered ring
3.613.100 - separate soldered ring
3.614.920 - U shaped ring
3.614.921 - U shaped ring
3.622.789 - U shaped ring
3.622.819 - U shaped ring
3.628.552 - separate soldered ring
3.636.146 - separate soldered ring
3.639.435 - U shaped ring
3.651.095 - separate soldered ring
3.657.214 - U shaped ring

[Kirchgoens]

I've seen the same thing. It's as if they were all tossed into the same pile, and then numbered. I even have a couple of them that are very, very close in number to my regular BM's. I've posted somewhere here in the forum about this with specific serial numbers in the 3,50x,xxx range with the same observation. This certainly sinks that myth floating around the former SU that these u-shaped/tongue BM's were awarded for the war against Japan. I believe that this has just about nothing at all to do with the type or numbering.

...Brian

[Eryk]

Not meaning to hijack the thread, but this brings up a larger issue. How were serial numbers allocated, and when in the production process were they added to the award?

For the first, in the time before instant communication and shared electronic data, there were two ways to handle allocation. The first is to limit production to a single place at any one time. There’s no need to distribute any data because it is only used in one place. The second is to allocate ‘blocks’ of numbers – facility A uses 0001 to 4999, facility B uses 5000 to 9999, for example.

The second issue relates to the first. If the s/n are added during the process and there are multiple production sites (which there were, multiple mints), then it has to be the second method. But why the mix of obviously different production medals with very close s/n?

There is another possibility, kind of a mix of the two allocation methods. (And as I just read what Brian thinks in his earlier thread.) Multiple sites produce the awards, but they are then all shipped to a central site for the application of the serial number. This would explain the mix of types of Bravery Medals with close serial numbers. Each stamper is working on a group of awards from multiple manufacturers, and simply stamps each with the next s/n.

Only problem with this is did they actually stamp awards after the enamel/whatever it is, is put in the letters? Seems a recipe to do damage. (With a rotating tool, or hand engraved it seems much less an issue.)

Anyone know the actual minting process of these awards?

[Kirchgoens]

Alfred - you, like me, have later BM's in near serial number proximity. If my theory of blocks being distributed to voenkomats at the end of the war as catch-ups is valid, then some of yours probably came from like areas (meaning they probably came from a couple particular geographic areas. The two that come to mind are your 3.47mil and 3.65mil awards. Do you have any idea which republic they came from? I have a large number of very close numbers in the 3.60x mil range that I know came from Uzbekistan. I have a post on that idea out there also - follow this link.

[Alfred]

Kirchgoens,

I have no idea from which region these medals are. I only saw the serial numbers and the shape of the ring on pictures availabe on the web and from my own pieces..

My intention was to find out how many of these U shaped medals were produced and related to that are there blocks of serial numbers with u-shaped rings to estimate the quantity .

So, if you have serial numbers and the ring version of the medal please let me know.

best regards
Andreas

[Kirchgoens]

Here you go: