Trandasir, Efim Petrovich, Beetroot Farmer?

[CtahhR]

I think the question mark in the thread title is very telling on its own.

All of us trying to piece the picture together here are all doing it completely free of charge in an attempt to further all of our understandings of these awards. All of us are putting time, effort and resources into this on our own free will in what we believe is a good cause. With this sort of situation even throwing money at it would not aid in any way as for now the citations for such awards are a closed book.

This is very much a "squeeze every penny" affair but here it is information and not finances.

I know if I got one cent per hour for efforts towards the forum and the hobby I could afford to buy myself something rather nice. I'm sure the situation is the same for many of us but working together we can become far more than the individual parts.

As with any group, the more items in it and information they supply the easier it is to come to a rational conclusion.

We are all on Occam's razor here.

[Lapa]

CtahhR,

In order to come to a rational conclusion, one would imperatively need to know all the ukazes that were issued in a specific day.

As Auke - who has been doing research for longer than many active members have been registered on this forum - has already mentioned several times, many ukazes were issued on any specific day. Unless you know the actual ukaz number, all you are doing is playing a guessing game.

Marc

[CtahhR]

Indeed it is a guessing game but the more evidence provided the more educated conclusions can be arrived at.

There was a Ukaz for Beetroots on one of the dates. If there also was for the other then that gives some momentum to that idea. If is not and two matching ukazes for a different profession well that may be more reasonable. There may not be two matching profession ukazes but at least we know the fact that a beetroot ukaz was decreed on the same date as one of these awards.

If we had gone onto the idea of saying it was awarded for inventing a chocolate radio headset then I think we would be in complete fantasy land as it stands a beetroot producer is a viable option.

[Auke]

The fact that this topic is in "The Researchers Corner" suggests that you have facts concerning the background of these awards, but you don't. It's not that this topic should be edited or added to when someone provides facts proving the contrary, it should be removed from this section now. Innocent [unresearched] until proven guilty [researched].

Occam's razor is a very dangerous method to use here! Are you really comparing research with probability? Should we really consider an award researched when somebody has provided a probable, but unproven story?

[RedMaestro2]

I was just looking over Supreme Soviet Gazette today but forgot to check these decrees. Next time I get to it I'll look.

[PaulR]

I look forward to seeing what you come up with. Thank you all for this discussion.

[EricFG]

Is there something funky going on with the red star on the bottom of the later ORBL or is it just me?

[Lapa]

Eric,

It is just slightly shifted. This can possibly be due to a loose rivet.

Marc

[PaulR]

I can take a look at that when I get home tonight.

[RedMaestro2]

I checked the gazette. The specific 15 February 1957 decree was not present. However, there were at least two decrees on the same day awarding the title Hero of Socialist Labor for beetroot farming. The way the gazette works, this implies there were other 15 February decrees awarding lower-level orders and medals for the same reason (beetroot farming). They probably weren't printed for length.

There was at least one other decree from that date awarding HSL titles for other reasons. I forget what specifically it was for, but it was short and distant enough from the above.


So given the match with the 1965 decree and the lack of alternative decrees, I think we're safe to say this pair of ORBL's is for beetroot farming. :)


The 1965 decree awarded about 15,000 people total. The gazette included a short summary of the decree and breakdown of numbers of each award per republic. This isn't particularly useful to us, given we don't know where exactly Trandasir lived.


I'd be interested to discuss if anyone thinks this research/conclusion isn't solid enough. (No challenge. Friendly, academic discussion :) )