"Sükhbaatar" Order.

[rboomsma]

Hello Dolf & forum

Have you seen this one on our favorite auction site. It is either a fake, or a new version. You can see the center is gold colored like the rest and the center peice looks like it is a part of the order, not a seperate piece. Enamel looks poor quality. And the center enamel is different color or wrong color. Order also looks like it is gold plated.

There is also no visible ser number.

Is this a new variation or???



[QUOTE=Dolf]Ron,

Anyway, if Shane did some little research he would find this very same info quite easily I guess :idea As we did...

[HuliganRS]

Looks cheap and poorly executed.


Rusty.

[Eugene]

The seller is from China. Maybe, it's original. Only modern Chinese variation?:)

[Dolf]

Originally Posted by rboomsma

Hello Dolf & forum

Have you seen this one on our favorite auction site. It is either a fake, or a new version. You can see the center is gold colored like the rest and the center peice looks like it is a part of the order, not a seperate piece. Enamel looks poor quality. And the center enamel is different color or wrong color. Order also looks like it is gold plated.

There is also no visible ser number.

Is this a new variation or???

Ron,

Thanks for posting this one.

I really don't know about this particular piece, but it really looks like the new Types of Mongolian Awards, since 2003. These new Orders are made of Brass, and only one piece, so this one looks like one of these, but honnestely I have no idea if they are also making new S-B in Mongolia! So far I have no information about that!

Anyway, for those interested in Mongolian Awards, be careful guys: I know from a very reliable source that if you are being offered some "rare old Orders"... you should be very suspicious... I still don't know the details yet, if these "rare old Orders" are faked or simply non-existant, so caution is my advice...

Best,

Dolf

[vatjan]

I have not seen one of these new brass SB orders, but I have confirmation that they exist. So it is probably one of these, I shall have pix from a reliable scource soon, so we shall be able to compare.
Jan

[Felix]

He really looks ugly ! I don't believe in a new variation as the Sukhe-Bator order is no longer attributed (since 2002).

[Dolf]

Jan,

So you confirm that this new brass Type of S-B (like the other 2003 brass Type we know they exist for other Orders) really exists!
That's indeed what this one posted by Ron looks like, as I mention on my previous post.

Please post pics when available.

Thanks for the info.

Originally Posted by Felix

He really looks ugly ! I don't believe in a new variation as the Sukhe-Bator order is no longer attributed (since 2002).

Felix,

Are you aware of the new brass, made of 1 piece Type for all other Mongolian Orders, Red Banner of Combat Valor, Red Banner of Labor Valor, Order of Combat Valor and Order of Polar Star, from 2003-2004?

I know they do exist.

So why not for the Order of Sukhbaatar?!

Dolf

[vatjan]

Well, as far as I know, the Sukhbaatar Order is still awarded, but it is no longer the highest order. The highest order is now the Chingis Khan Order, which has only been awarded once sofar, on july 11th 2005, to former president Ochirbat.
Jan

[rboomsma]

I am thinking it is a new variation but there is no mention of it in the New Mongolian Orders book:confused: , as for those of us lucky enough to have one of the gold ones there is no comparison.

I have bought from this seller in China and have had no problems, but who knows.

These newer cheap orders from 2003 up, just don't compare to the older variations. I will stick to the older stuff.

If this is a fake meant to fool us, I doubt it would even fool a new collector to Mongolian Orders:rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Dolf

Jan,

So you confirm that this new brass Type of S-B (like the other 2003 brass Type we know they exist for other Orders) really exists!
That's indeed what this one posted by Ron looks like, as I mention on my previous post.

Please post pics when available.

Thanks for the info.

Dolf

[Dolf]

Originally Posted by rboomsma

I am thinking it is a new variation but there is no mention of it in the New Mongolian Orders book:confused: , as for those of us lucky enough to have one of the gold ones there is no comparison.

I have bought from this seller in China and have had no problems, but who knows.

These newer cheap orders from 2003 up, just don't compare to the older variations. I will stick to the older stuff.

If this is a fake meant to fool us, I doubt it would even fool a new collector to Mongolian Orders:rolleyes:

Ron,

It really seems to be one of those new 2003-2004 new brass and 1 piece made Type of Orders.

I've also bought stuff from that seller, a long time ago (before he raised his prices really a bit too much) and the rare few times I did it everything was ok.

As for comparing the quality of these new brass Orders with the old silver/gold ones... well, can we compare a Rolls Royce with a Fiat Punto?... :-))
I do have one of these new brass Orders, a Polar Star, and indeed, no possible comparision...
I wouldn't buy one of these S-B, unless if a real bargain, but I'd like to add to my collection one of each of the other Orders, just as a kind of curiosity I guess.
Anyway, I've been told that when they will show up they will sell for the same price as the old ones!
Btw I recently saw one of these (Order of Combat Valor) being sold on e... for more $$$ than many older ones! Apart from a few Polar Star this one (and now also apparently this S-B) are the only two pieces of this Type that I've seen for sale. And as we know some people have a huge joy being the 1st ones to own everything new in the market...

Best,

Dolf