Soviet Patches Collection 1947-92

[pastfinder]

Page 30 of the book Soviet Arm Badges, by Col. Stepanov, has a page of Soviet Border Guard patches. Notable are airborne, cavalry, and aviation units.

What the complete roles of the border troops were I do not know, but Soviet airborne forces have been used as land forces repeatedly instead of purely air dropped forces. Perhaps the men who wore these insignia were trained airborne personnel but employed in a grounded role. Perhaps airborne personnel reassigned to border guard work were allowed to keep their airborne designation, hence the creation of the catch.

Bottom line is that we just don't have enough information on some of these and until we do we are just going around in circles.

I don't have many books on Soviet military forces, but I have one Russian Military Power, by Bonanza Books, published in 1982, that lists the following on page 37:

"The KGB Border Troops have a complete range of AFVs (Armored Fighting Vehicles), and also aircraft and artillery. The coastguard element have fast missile-armed patrol boats. Border clashes with the Chinese on the Ussuri River and in Central Asia involved the KGB troops, not MoD troops."

"Security Troops of the KGB guard key governmental installations throughout the USSR. In Moscow they guard the Kremlin, and have elements close to all large army barracks. They provide guards at all nuclear plants and Strategic Rocket Forces installations. Theirs is the responsibility for handling nuclear warheads in the armed forces, even on the battlefield. They also provide a secure high-level communications net for the armed forces and for ruling elements of the Party."

[desantnik]

And I missed the reference to airborne border troops...

I'm glad you refer to sources and would encourage your quest.

I am a military officer with several years' service in airborne units and following the Soviet Union/Russia for over 20 years. I too have a fair share of references and yes, there are mistakes in them, especially ones from the Cold War when the Soviet Union was a closed country.

Again, airborne troops allow a deliberate, forced entry capability behind enemy lines. Due to the time required to plan an operation, marshal aircraft, and then employ, they would hardly be effective in a reactive, border troop-type operation.

Border Guards prevent or react to a violation of a site, be it a wet or dry border or important locale. Using airborne to either preemptively guard or react to a border/site violation is completely counterintuitive.

I encourage your further research and will be happy to admit I'm wrong, but believe you'll be hard-pressed to find any country that has airborne border guards, let alone any reference to Soviet airborne border guards.

If you'd like we could make a gentlemen's bet out of this to be judged by a neutral jury, but in the meantime this discussion is going nowhere.

[centaur32]

Greetings Desantnik,

Thanks for the compliment. Like every other serious collector, I'm sure, my collection gives me a great deal of pleasure.

While I agree that everyone is prone to mistakes, I very much doubt it in this instance. Since, during his service in the Soviet and now the Russian Federation Army Colonel Stepanov has held the respected office of Deputy Chief of the Military Heraldry Department of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces. He is also a researcher and collector of military uniforms and insignia, especially of the Red and Soviet Armies, of more than thirty years experience, resulting in his authorship of about forty publications on the history, uniforms, and traditions of the Soviet and other armed forces. While still on active duty, he is currently Deputy Editor-in-Chief of [I]Zuughaus[I] magazine, which publishes authoritative articles on Soviet and Russian Federation militaria.

I disagree that "mission", alone, is evidence of the existence, or otherwise, of a type of insignia. Unlike the border guards of other countries, the Soviet Border Guards were an elite service and were one of the four main elements of the armed forces of the Soviet Union (VS-SSSR), while the other three were, of course, the Soviet Army, Soviet Navy, and the Interior Army of the MVD. The Soviet Border Guards had a long history of frontline combat and were deployed in varied military roles, including infantry, cavalry, reconnaissance, naval and airforce units. Consequently, they were equipped with tanks, armored personnel carriers, small warships, armed helicopters, and light military aircraft. Therefore, as you will note, Soviet Border Guards did a bit more than, “….sit in established outposts or patrol along a very narrow strip of land along the border checking vehicles, documents, etc.” The Soviet Union was not the first government to employ airborne qualified troops as regular infantry units, under Army command.

Having personally witnessed the fiscal excesses of the Soviet Armed Forces I don’t think that the paucity of the required number of Border Troops VDV patches and the resultant expense would have worried the KGB Border Guard Command for one moment.

Finally, until one of us produces definitive, hard evidence to support our respective positions on this question it will remain unresolved and the debate may continue. After all, the purpose of any forum is healthy debate, is it not? Thanks for your contribution. I’ll be back in touch regarding this issue when I have the evidence to support my contention that the Border Troops VDV patch is authentic.

Cheers & Happy Collecting,

Jim

[OKP]

Actually the patch with the airborne on green background was used by the PV units called DshMG or Air assault manoeuvre group.Each unit of the Central Asian Border District had 1 DshMG element.These were used for opsoperations during the war in Afghanistan.
The airborne metal insignia was worn on collar tabs as well.
Check carefully the collar insignias and the arm patches...

[pastfinder]

Reminds me of this uniform sold on ebay years ago.

[OKP]

Yep I do have this pic as well in my data bank.
But the insignas mounting is too bad : collar tabs are the ones for greatcoat not for service jacket and shoulder boards should be correctly sewn over the shoulder loops....Regarding the beret,no markings on the intern diamond so far.....

[centaur32]

G'day OKP & Pastfinder,

Thanks for the great color photos of the VDV patches on Border TRoops green and particularly the one of them in wear outside the Kremlin wall by a couple of obviously happy Dimbels (Note the borders on the patches). I was particularly thankful for the unit data provided by OKP. I suppose this ends the debate regarding the authenticity of the VDV patches on Border TRoops green. Thanks again guys.

Cheers,

Jim

[desantnik]

OK, I guess I can eat crow on the existence of green airborne sleeve patches. Nice period photos, but things on eBay are less certain.

Permit me one of my original points on the existence of "airborne" Border Guards. I had heard of DShB (air assault units), but until now didn't know they were Border Guards units. These guys pictured were helicopter-delivered units that apparently wore green airborne patches, collar insignia, and telnyashki, but were not actually "knees in the breeze" airborne paratroopers. Despite the plethora of insignia, there don't seem to be any airborne badges.

[centaur32]

G'day Paul,

So, if I understand your logic, then, the 82nd & 101st Airborne qualified troops who were Airmobile in Viet Nam were not really Airborne troops because their knees were only in the wind blowing through the open doors of the UH-1D helicopters delivering them to their Landing Zones and you are applying this logic to the Soviet Air Assault Troops......or am I misunderstanding you?

Cheers,

Jim

[OKP]

Originally Posted by desantnik

OK, I guess I can eat crow on the existence of green airborne sleeve patches. Nice period photos, but things on eBay are less certain.

Permit me one of my original points on the existence of "airborne" Border Guards. I had heard of DShB (air assault units), but until now didn't know they were Border Guards units. These guys pictured were helicopter-delivered units that apparently wore green airborne patches, collar insignia, and telnyashki, but were not actually "knees in the breeze" airborne paratroopers. Despite the plethora of insignia, there don't seem to be any airborne badges.

*DshB are regular army airborne units you don't find them in Border guards.
For exemple the Border unit of Kerki in Tadjikistan near the afghan border had 1 DshMG and 3 MMG (literrally Motorised Manoeuvre Group).
*It is true that 99% of the patches sold on E*** are fakes made in Ukraine.
*To get back to DshMG,these were heliborne transported units,therefore none is jump qualified like a regular paratrooper.
Here is a pic of a DshMG trooper from the Central Asian district,wearing no jump badge at all,just the usual border qualification and units badges....