Italian Auction - 'Stalin'

[DougD]

I have gotten quite a few e-mails about the higher end named uniforms in the Italian "Red" auction...most questions seem to be about the "Stalin" M1943 summer white uniform. I can not say if its his or not, but below would be some of my concerns.

1. History / Provenance - How did the uniform get into a private collection? Not impossible, but I would want to know who it came from, etc.

2. From the photos I have seen Stalin seems to be wearing M1943 tunics in white cotton (the one in the auction is in silk). That does not mean much; I might be wrong and the photos might show him in a silk tunic and I am off base, or simply I have yet to see a photo of him in a silk tunic (I don't think I am as self centered as some to invoke the "I have never seen it so it's not real" rule).

3. The boards: This one bothers me most...no matter how you look at it, they don't seem to be a good match for the tunic...they seem real (at least from the photo) but too long for the tunic. Boards were different lengths and were matched, in general, to the size of the tunic. Some might be a little long or a little short, but these look quite a bit too long for this tunic (even if pushing them closer to the collar). I would think that Stalins boards would be a perfect match. My first impression is that "They don't fit".

If anyone else has any observations about this uniform, air them here.

DougD

[DougD]

Here is Stalin in what I would say is a cotton M1943 Summer white tunic...note the more substantial collar. Also, note the size of the boards in relation to the tunic.

[Commissar]

Could it be possible there was more than one variation of the same style or make?
For some reason I could see Stalin having a massive wardrobe with all sorts of fancy clothes. :P

[charlet]

I see the question in another way: could it be possible that Stalin jackets ever circulated on collectors market? :D

[Esteban_cool]

I saw a website where Stalin´s gray uniform was displayed in a private collection. It stated that the owner acquired it from one of Stalin´s bodyguards after the fall of the SU, but why a bodyguard would keep his boss´uniform? And how would he be allowed to keep it after destalinization?

[DougD]

Lets keep the focus of this thread on this "Italian-Stalin" uniform; here we have one that is claimed, in the open, to be Stalin, and is quite expensive...thus, I think its fair game for full and open discussion. As to other uniforms, until they are up for sale, lets let anyone claim what they wish.

DougD

[Ser-g]

how common is this tunic if it was just a white uniform whiteout boards and no claim to it.

I mean could it be possible for that this tunic is a put together one ?
- the boards don't match
- some what different collar (not rounded of)

is this a possibility ,, it was my very first though when i saw this.

[DougD]

Ser-g,

The tunic itself is not rare, as it would have been for one star generals on up...I am sure its an ok tunic...but I am not sure its Stalin's...something like that has to have great provenance in order to be accepted...simply saying it is Stalin's uniform or making a mannequin to look like Stalin is not enough as there is no real difference in the tunic between one star and Generalissimo. The material and shoulder-board spacing would be stop signs for me.

DougD

[Tretov]

The uniform sold at 30.000 EUR.

[kameli]

Originally Posted by Tretov

The uniform sold at 30.000 EUR.

A lot of money for "maybe" uniform!

The fact is that there is no way to prove its originality as Stalin´s uniform.

/Jussi-Pekka