1940's cap badge, but pre or post 1945 ??

plmurphy · 09-02-2006, 02:42 PM

Here is a recent purchase which I made. It is a basic red army cap badge from the 1940's. I would be grateful if the more knowledgeable among you could advise if it is pre or post 1945 and how you can tell the difference between war time and post war issued cap badges. It is about 28mm from star point to point, made from brass and has a small ding in the hard enamel.

Regards,

Paul

Taz · 09-02-2006, 05:17 PM

Hi Paul,

Not really much help but early cap badges and WW II era were made of Brass and enamel, later from the 1960's they were aluminium and paint. So your badge is most likely a 1940s - 60's Navy sailor or NCO 'Donald Duck' cap badge.

Here is an indication of what hat it belonged to.

Approx. 25 mm - Soviet officer or private side cap.
Approx. 28 mm - Navy sailor or NCO 'Donald Duck' cap
Approx. 32-34 mm - officer visor hat.

Eddie.

plmurphy · 09-03-2006, 03:30 PM

Hi Eddie,

Many thanks for the reply. I was aware of the switch in quality in the early 60's but what I am curious about is whether or not it is possible to tell if a brass and enamel badge is pre or post 1945 ? I suspect that the answer is "no" but am hopeful that some of you experts here will be able to shed some more light on this for me.

Best regards,

Paul

Taz · 09-03-2006, 03:56 PM

Your welcome Paul,
I think you will find that the design and materials remained the same from the 40's through to the 60's without change so you probably won't be able to narrow it down further than that. Maybe Doug has some thoughts on that, if anyone knows he will :)

Regards Eddie

DougD · 09-03-2006, 04:16 PM

I'd like to say I know for em/officers, but i doubt there was a set change in 1945 (there was not for generals; no way to see if a generals cap badge is 1945 or 1947) for these badges. I guess it goes for feel, no other real way to do it.

DD

plmurphy · 09-04-2006, 01:28 AM

Many thanks, I appreciate the help and guidance.

Paul

Lapa · 09-04-2006, 02:17 AM

Paul, Eddie,

Earlier models for officers had the Hammer and Sicle as a separate piece secured with 2 rivets.

Marc

Alfred · 09-04-2006, 12:50 PM

here is one with a separate attached hammer and sickle

regards
Andreas

plmurphy · 09-04-2006, 01:17 PM

Gentlemen,

Many thanks. It is a pleasure to be among people who are willing to share their knowledge so generously.

Regards,

Paul

Nack · 09-08-2006, 10:06 PM

And to flesh this out a bit more, I belive the earlier 2-piece type that Lapa refers to is generally pre-war era. I think I read somewhere that early in the war the switch was made to the 1-piece type.

09-02-2006, 05:17 PM	#2
Taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Herford, Germany Age: 65 Posts: 2,152	Hi Paul, Not really much help but early cap badges and WW II era were made of Brass and enamel, later from the 1960's they were aluminium and paint. So your badge is most likely a 1940s - 60's Navy sailor or NCO 'Donald Duck' cap badge. Here is an indication of what hat it belonged to. Approx. 25 mm - Soviet officer or private side cap. Approx. 28 mm - Navy sailor or NCO 'Donald Duck' cap Approx. 32-34 mm - officer visor hat. Eddie. __________________ Everybody's equal, But some more than others! "Those who come to us with the sword - will be killed by the sword" - Alexander Nevski Last edited by Taz; 09-03-2006 at 02:40 AM.

09-03-2006, 03:56 PM	#4
Taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Herford, Germany Age: 65 Posts: 2,152	Your welcome Paul, I think you will find that the design and materials remained the same from the 40's through to the 60's without change so you probably won't be able to narrow it down further than that. Maybe Doug has some thoughts on that, if anyone knows he will :) Regards Eddie __________________ Everybody's equal, But some more than others! "Those who come to us with the sword - will be killed by the sword" - Alexander Nevski

09-03-2006, 04:16 PM	#5
DougD Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: NJ Age: 50 Posts: 2,060	cap badge I'd like to say I know for em/officers, but i doubt there was a set change in 1945 (there was not for generals; no way to see if a generals cap badge is 1945 or 1947) for these badges. I guess it goes for feel, no other real way to do it. DD

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09-03-2006, 03:30 PM	#3
plmurphy Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: London Age: 54 Posts: 49	Hi Eddie, Many thanks for the reply. I was aware of the switch in quality in the early 60's but what I am curious about is whether or not it is possible to tell if a brass and enamel badge is pre or post 1945 ? I suspect that the answer is "no" but am hopeful that some of you experts here will be able to shed some more light on this for me. Best regards, Paul

09-04-2006, 01:28 AM	#6
plmurphy Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: London Age: 54 Posts: 49	Many thanks, I appreciate the help and guidance. Paul

09-04-2006, 02:17 AM	#7
Lapa Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: St Petersburg, Russia Age: 63 Posts: 2,397	Paul, Eddie, Earlier models for officers had the Hammer and Sicle as a separate piece secured with 2 rivets. Marc

09-04-2006, 01:17 PM	#9
plmurphy Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: London Age: 54 Posts: 49	Gentlemen, Many thanks. It is a pleasure to be among people who are willing to share their knowledge so generously. Regards, Paul

09-08-2006, 10:06 PM	#10
Nack Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The Buckeye State Age: 46 Posts: 513	And to flesh this out a bit more, I belive the earlier 2-piece type that Lapa refers to is generally pre-war era. I think I read somewhere that early in the war the switch was made to the 1-piece type.

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