Red Banner.

[Frieza]

hi everyone. I'm looking for pictures of the Order of the Red Banner 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th awards, does anyone know where i could find some?

[Tal Inbar]

Hi

You can look at the book "orders and medals of the USSR" by Shishkov & Muzalevsky, ( Vol. 1, pp. 53-58) or the "comperehensive guide to orders and medals" by McDaniel.

I will try to post some photos.

Tal

[Art]

Frieza,

I have some of the suspension Red Banner's here on the website. ( I have a 2nd and 3rd awarding at the moment ) help yourself to any of the images if you want to save them on your computer for future reference. Here's a hint, try to name them according to the Type and Variation. ( example, rbannerT2V1.jpg for Red Banner type 2 Variation 1 ) This way you'll have a constantly growing library of pictures which you can use to identify anything you may encounter. Here is a quick link to the main site with the info:

Red Banner


Art

[Eugene]

Red Banner 8th award doesn't exist. I mean real one. It was issued less than 20 of 7th award.

Here is 5th award and more pictures

[Art]

Remember, besides McDaniel and his book, there is no rule of law for this hobby. We learn by observing. Many rare things exist which McDaniel doesn't have in his book, on the other hand, forgeries abound..who knows what is real? Scepticism about such a high award is good. It shows we can openly debate such a sensitive topic. And we should continue to do this. Bits of information come to light that might not have otherwise..but, we must do so as gentlemen. And not at the cost of doubting someone's honesty or integrity. Especially in a public forum, keep up the good work but please keep it factual and unbiased.

Art

[Tal Inbar]

Please look at this pic:

It looks like a modified number 3, doesn't it?

[Art]

Tal,

What book is that from? try to post a closeup of it if it really looks like an altered #3...

[Tal Inbar]

This is the book (I don't have it so i only have the scan above):

[CZ]

Dear Tal,

if you photograph a "8" in this way, any "8" will might appear as a faked "3".

The booklet you showed to us is the most widely spread book about soviet awards in Austria and Germany and was written by Dr. Dietrich Herfurth, the most senior expert of soviet decorations in Germany (who was already "the" expert of soviet miliary decorations in the old German Democratic Republic, where he published his first book about soviet military awards 20 years ago).

Dr. Herfurth takes his photographic illustrations from pictures shot by Jean Molitor or himself taken decades ago at soviet military museums. Some photographs are from the McDaniel/Schmitt-book.

So I don't understand what you want to tell to us. Shall we suspect honorable Dr. Herfurth to publish photographs of fakes in his booK?

Regards from Vienna

[Tal Inbar]

Dear Mr Zulus

As you felt very often insulted and offended by members of the forum, I can not understand your writing style, when you adress others.

I merely made a point, by showing the "number 8", that I find it very odd, since not a single book (McDaniel, Shishkov, Kutsenko - to name a few) E V E R talked about REAL Order of the Red Banner number 8.

I am positive that the honorable Heer Dr. Herfurth didn't INTENTIONALLY included fakes in his work. It happens even to the best (you can find a fake RSFSR Red banner in McDaniel's book).

I have asked for educated remarks, not insults. In the future, it will be helpfull to us all, if anyone will adress the others in the same manner as he expect others to adress him.

Tal Inbar