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+----- Thread: Fake Documented Groups of Orders (/Thread-Fake-Documented-Groups-of-Orders)
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Tal Inbar - 09-25-2002
Just adding to the above:
1. Fake black patina is obvious (especially on BK)
2. Where is the date in the OK for the order of Kutozov?
well, what a day - may 6 1953, TWO orders the same day...
3. Again, the path is repeated - simpe awards first (Oh, sir, they are missing...) and the big ones down below.
I think - Most likely the BK is a fake, and the entries in the OK - are faked for sure.
Tal
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - AlexF. - 09-25-2002
Hi,
I totally agree with Ed, and won't repead what he already stated so nicely. Just to add, Kutuzov IIIcl. is definitely a fake, for many reasons. The scan of BK doesn't allow to determine anything for sure, it's just too small and lacks details.
I have a couple of Kutuzov's IIIcl, different variants (though all screwbacks), some with Pauls COA, it is apparent that yours doesn't look even close to any of mine, when it comes to collar details, hair, hairlines inside the tower, the concentric circles on reverse, and of course, the mint mark.
Hope you didn't pay for this "group" yet...
Alex.
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - sovvisor - 09-25-2002
i´m sorry but I agree with the rest of the crew. The ink is the same as I´ve seen on many fake entries in medal and order books and also on NKVD documents lately.
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Nota Bene - 09-25-2002
Gentlemen,
You seen to be forgetting about the Khmelnitsky, which I think is also a fake.
Alexei
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Tal Inbar - 09-27-2002
Alexei - note my reply, I didn't forget BK...
I would like to post an opposite situation:
The Higher awards are gone, and two lower are present:
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Tal Inbar - 09-27-2002
BTW, I am unfamilliar with this style of writing "Al Nevski":
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Ed Maier - 09-27-2002
Tal,
I'm assuming that you are posting this picture as a fake set as well, so I might be restating the obvious, but I don't like it either. Granted, it is strange to see the lower end items there, but only the Lenin is original for the book, and it may have been added as well into a blank book. The Lenin and book are 1951 issue (probably Long Service). The Nevsky would be 1944-45, and its in different ink, so it was added after 1951. The Red Banner and Red Star are post war but should be for around the mid 1950s, but received five years apart, but they are also added to the book in the same ink. I also do not like the style of stamps and writting for any of the awards, although that doesn't mean they are incorrect as a lot of 1950 books have strange writting. If I had to bet money, I would say that the awards were added to the book to make the available lower end medals more attractive because of the Lenin and Nevsky.
Just my opinion,
Ed
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Nota Bene - 09-27-2002
Tal,
Just to add to what Ed have said, you are absolutely right about "Al. Nevsky". That's weird!
Alexei
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - Nota Bene - 09-27-2002
Oooooops! Sorry!
Quote:Originally posted by Tal Inbar
Alexei - note my reply, I didn't forget BK...
Fake Documented Groups of Orders - new world - 09-27-2002
Guys,
Thank you so much for the input on the Kutuzov/BK group!
I was sure that the doc was an outright fake, but had my doubts about the awards.
But again, if the awards were to be authentic - there is no reason to fake the doc - they would be selling for good price without the doc.