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+---- Thread: Soviet uniforms -- for comment (/Thread-Soviet-uniforms-for-comment)
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - medals73 - 01-12-2008
desantnik Wrote:Ed, I'll caveat my comment with the disclaimer that I'm not a cloth guy.
I don't like the appearance of this piece. The red stripe was worn by partisans as an identifying feature on civilian clothes - something done going back to the Civil War.
You have to ask why both the hat and red stripe look like they were made yesterday. Pieces I've seen with these red stripes always look like they were worn for months or years in the field, around camp fires, getting rain and snowed on, etc.
I have had similar thoughts, and await forum discussion.
I stumble into cloth with some expert guidance (since I can't affort metal and enamel any more), but still "stumble".
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - desantnik - 01-12-2008
Medvedev was also a very famous NKVD partisan leader. I'm sure the name wasn't chosen randomly (if that's the name written inside, I can't see it completely).
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - medals73 - 01-12-2008
And, one more. While I generally don't much like the post-1943 neo-Tsarist stuff, this fills a nice niche in the developing collection. Navy Engineer Senior Lieutenant.
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - DougD - 01-12-2008
The RCW fur cap came from me, and Its not from a marginal source at all, but rather one of the bigger uniform guys in Moscow. The Osprey book by Khvostov shows it being used by early Red Army rifle units, but i can't say I know much more, but i do stand behind it. The name is pretty common, I don't think we can draw much from that.
Here is a VERY similar cap (i won't say identical) from P.196 of "Red Army Uniforms 1918-1945" by Shalito, Savchenkov, and Tseplenkov (the cap in this thread came from one of them i'll add); the cap in the book is almost identical in construction, wear, weathering, and stripe; it might be a repro, but i do not feel that it is. I do respect Desantnik's opinion, but must say I disagree with it here.
Also, here is the illustration from the early Red Army osprey book; i don't say drawings show much ( you can DRAW anything) but still, here it is; according to Khvotsov it is an early Red Army rifleman from the Taman area ( though i would guess everyone in that era was more or less a 'partisan'.)
DougD
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - desantnik - 01-12-2008
Doug, I don't have a problem with the fact that the cap and red strip were worn by partisans.
Again, repeating my caveat that I'm not a cloth guy, as a "lay person" I just don't like its and its ribbon's out of the box appearance in comparison to other pieces I've seen.
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - DougD - 01-12-2008
Desantnik,
No, i know you were just talking about condition etc, i just thought you might be thinking it was a 1941/1945 Partisan rather than a RCW rifleman. No big deal!
Again, with cloth items it can be tough and we can disagree, its no problem : )
DougD
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - Lapa - 01-12-2008
Doug,
The ushanka you show as well as the one on the drawing are markedly different from the hat Ed showed: different model altogether, different fabric...
Marc
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - DougD - 01-12-2008
marc,
I did not say the two were identical if you read my post, but if you look they are very similar. I also would not call them different models altogether though just because they have different fabric. I would not expect all the ushankas of that era to be identical, would you? The two have very similar wear / weathering patterns, etc. My post was mainly in response to desantniks about condition: here I show one from a very well respected publication that has very similar construction, wear, etc.
DougD
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - desantnik - 01-12-2008
DougD Wrote:Desantnik,
No, i know you were just talking about condition etc, i just thought you might be thinking it was a 1941/1945 Partisan rather than a RCW rifleman. No big deal!
Again, with cloth items it can be tough and we can disagree, its no problem : )
DougD
OK, that point I lost and now I figured out that RCW = Russian Civil War. I was thinking something along the lines "R? (Cold Weather?)".
Soviet uniforms -- for comment - medals73 - 01-29-2008
Air Force general.