Miniatures Of Soviet Awards. - Page 2

***desantnik*** · 11-30-2006, 08:52 AM

I agree the mint would be the best one to settle this question. True, the Voennii Vestnik writer may have done more research than just answering the letter.

If we still go with my belief in Soviet origin, a possibility could be a NON-military audience - labor or a civilian ministry like Ministry of Foreign Affairs and thus Voennii Vestnik wouldn't know anything about it.

If we discard the Soviet origin, does anyone else have any ideal what other country could have made them? Does Poland have a tradition of wearing miniatures, for example? If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say Poland or Czechoslovakia... I feel we could rule out Albania, Yugoslavia, East Germany.

Al-muell · 11-30-2006, 09:54 AM

I have seen polish soldiers (especially veterans) wearing miniature awards. Unfortunately I lack sources to say when were they introduced and what are the origins of this tradition. The letter I posted was an answer to a request from polish officer (still in active service by then unless I am mistaken).

I have seen Yugoslavian miniature awards, however they were always attached to a ribbon bar (normal ribbon bar, not miniature ribbon)...

You may be right about a non-military origin. I would, however, guess that it could have been someone's personal initiative.

Lapa · 11-30-2006, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desantnik

...If we still go with my belief in Soviet origin, a possibility could be a NON-military audience - labor or a civilian ministry like Ministry of Foreign Affairs and thus Voennii Vestnik wouldn't know anything about it...

Paul,

It seems to me that a Soviet ministry would order its wears from the official state awards supplier, in this case, Monetniy Dvor.

Marc

Nota Bene · 11-30-2006, 07:28 PM

Paul,

I don't believe that miniatures were ever worn in the SU, not by the military, nor by the civilians. Even the Soviet diplomats on formal ocasions requiring them to wear dress uniforms with all the awards did not wear the miniatures. Also traditionally the Soviets did not wear tuxedos.

Another reason why I don't believe these are Soviet made is the quality. For instance, in comparison with a 50 Years in KPSS badge, made by the Moscow mint, these are crude.

In any case this is just my opinion.

Alexei

Rick Research · 11-30-2006, 08:02 PM

I remember these being quite common in Manion's sales etc of the mid-1990s, as if from a single cache being dispersed, but have never seen any offered for sale since.

They also sold (out?) for about $3 each in smaller ephemeral militaria catalogs of that period. I first got into Soviet in '94, and these were around about then, before I paid any attention to them.

Though they seemed endless at the time, apparently only the one lot and that's scattered to the winds.

Nota Bene · 11-30-2006, 08:08 PM

Rick,

Do you have any pictures to post?

Alexei

***desantnik*** · 12-01-2006, 08:31 AM

Alexei, I agree with your logic pertaining to Soviet wear and/or manufacture.

These are still enigmatic though and if the Soviet Union didn't manufacture them - who did? I don't believe an individual in any former Soviet bloc country would have had "commissioned" the creation of these and if the Soviet Union didn't produce them, what country did? It's not like there were hundreds of foreign recipients - only 20 Lenins were awarded to foreigners during WWII.

Nota Bene · 12-02-2006, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desantnik

These are still enigmatic though and if the Soviet Union didn't manufacture them - who did? I don't believe an individual in any former Soviet bloc country would have had "commissioned" the creation of these and if the Soviet Union didn't produce them, what country did? It's not like there were hundreds of foreign recipients - only 20 Lenins were awarded to foreigners during WWII.

Paul,

Those are good questions, I wish I had good answers. Hmmm... Do you think we could write a letter to the Polish mint?

Alexei

willie777 · 12-02-2006, 10:22 PM

We could, I doubt we'd recieve a reply though. We could also email them if anyone knows polish.

***Art*** · 12-03-2006, 03:15 PM

It would probably help if there was a forum member with contacts either within the Polish government or at the mint. Perhaps they could "pull some strings" for us.

12-02-2006, 10:22 PM	#19
willie777 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 392	We could, I doubt we'd recieve a reply though. We could also email them if anyone knows polish. Last edited by willie777; 12-02-2006 at 10:24 PM.

12-03-2006, 03:15 PM	#20
*Art* Forum Founder Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Buffalo NY Age: 58 Posts: 1,646	It would probably help if there was a forum member with contacts either within the Polish government or at the mint. Perhaps they could "pull some strings" for us. __________________ Visit the main site to the forum: The Soviet Military Awards Page Want to sell awards on the forum? Please read the FAQ Important Links: Forum announcements and rules \| Image posting FAQ

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11-30-2006, 08:52 AM	#11
*desantnik* Forum Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Eurasia Posts: 2,344	I agree the mint would be the best one to settle this question. True, the Voennii Vestnik writer may have done more research than just answering the letter. If we still go with my belief in Soviet origin, a possibility could be a NON-military audience - labor or a civilian ministry like Ministry of Foreign Affairs and thus Voennii Vestnik wouldn't know anything about it. If we discard the Soviet origin, does anyone else have any ideal what other country could have made them? Does Poland have a tradition of wearing miniatures, for example? If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say Poland or Czechoslovakia... I feel we could rule out Albania, Yugoslavia, East Germany.

11-30-2006, 09:54 AM	#12
Al-muell Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Wrocław, Poland Posts: 1,828	I have seen polish soldiers (especially veterans) wearing miniature awards. Unfortunately I lack sources to say when were they introduced and what are the origins of this tradition. The letter I posted was an answer to a request from polish officer (still in active service by then unless I am mistaken). I have seen Yugoslavian miniature awards, however they were always attached to a ribbon bar (normal ribbon bar, not miniature ribbon)... You may be right about a non-military origin. I would, however, guess that it could have been someone's personal initiative.

11-30-2006, 07:28 PM	#14
Nota Bene Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: New York USA Posts: 2,296	Paul, I don't believe that miniatures were ever worn in the SU, not by the military, nor by the civilians. Even the Soviet diplomats on formal ocasions requiring them to wear dress uniforms with all the awards did not wear the miniatures. Also traditionally the Soviets did not wear tuxedos. Another reason why I don't believe these are Soviet made is the quality. For instance, in comparison with a 50 Years in KPSS badge, made by the Moscow mint, these are crude. In any case this is just my opinion. Alexei

11-30-2006, 08:02 PM	#15
Rick Research Fallen Comrade Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New England Posts: 44	I remember these being quite common in Manion's sales etc of the mid-1990s, as if from a single cache being dispersed, but have never seen any offered for sale since. They also sold (out?) for about $3 each in smaller ephemeral militaria catalogs of that period. I first got into Soviet in '94, and these were around about then, before I paid any attention to them. Though they seemed endless at the time, apparently only the one lot and that's scattered to the winds.

11-30-2006, 08:08 PM	#16
Nota Bene Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: New York USA Posts: 2,296	Rick, Do you have any pictures to post? Alexei

12-01-2006, 08:31 AM	#17
*desantnik* Forum Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Eurasia Posts: 2,344	Alexei, I agree with your logic pertaining to Soviet wear and/or manufacture. These are still enigmatic though and if the Soviet Union didn't manufacture them - who did? I don't believe an individual in any former Soviet bloc country would have had "commissioned" the creation of these and if the Soviet Union didn't produce them, what country did? It's not like there were hundreds of foreign recipients - only 20 Lenins were awarded to foreigners during WWII.

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