Soviet Busts.

exiled · 06-16-2004, 07:21 PM

Is their anyway of tracking items originality? I have a very interesting bronze bust of Stalin which was owned by Molotov. It is actually 1 of 6 which was made for the 6 heads of government! When Stalin died and Khrushchev's destalinization program was enforced it was saved. So it is probably the only one still left. But how do you prove something like this?

Any help would be appreciated.

HuliganRS · 06-17-2004, 08:26 AM

exiled,

Welcome to the forum!

Are there any markings on it? Knowing the Soviet system, it sure must have a few QA marks, manufacturing marks as well as the artists name...

Rusty.

Tal Inbar · 06-17-2004, 11:59 AM

I have the pillow of Lenin.........it is in my collection next the hat of Brezhnev....

Siriously, what proof can you provide regarding authenticity of the bust?

Tal

exiled · 06-17-2004, 01:37 PM

The mark is A. Mosvtormet, Mosvtormet which was and still is a big metal's company maybe A. Mosvtormet was the director of the company? Apart from that and the date I have no other information. I can understand peoples perception that hey it's another con, but it isn't I'm not here to sell this piece I am here to find information.

Tal your question and I quote "Siriously, what proof can you provide regarding authenticity of the bust"

Well you're asking me the same question that I originally asked, if I had proof of its authenticity I wouldn't have posted the question would I.

Tal Inbar · 06-17-2004, 04:50 PM

exiled,

Once again - what made you think this bust was Molotov's?

Tal

Possible means to validate your claim:
1. Signed document by Molotov regarding this bust;
2. " Molotov's family member;
3. Official document which states the presentation of the bust to Molotov

Of course, each and every one of the above could be a fake.
Meanwhile it is just a story, like MANY other ebay legends.

otlichnik · 06-18-2004, 02:57 AM

I think your best bet would be to go the art history route. There must be some source, either book or professor at a Russian university or art gallery who would know about this. Items like this would have been well known in the art community. Even an office of Christie's auction house.

Shawn

new world · 06-18-2004, 04:27 AM

As Tal said - there's no proof this belonged to Molotov and nothing on the bust identifies the owner. The writing contains name of the manufacturer and the date.

William

exiled · 06-18-2004, 06:13 AM

Tal

The bust was taken out of the Kremlin by a friend of Molotovs he also worked at the Kremlin. He later immigrated to Israel and left the bust with the present owner. It is difficult to prove and I believe a museum or auction house would be my best bet.

Tal Inbar · 06-18-2004, 06:33 AM

The story sounds VERY uncreadible. Very. When this "Molotov's freind" imigrated to Israel? What proofs he has to back up the story? Did he presented his ID and permition to enter the Kremlin, from the time he claimed to work there?

As for now, I find any "discussion" on the subject futile, and as I said before in this thread - a story, with NO facts what so ever to proove it. I for one will not take part in future remarks on this story, unless some VERY convincing facts will show up. I would rather eat Swiss chease than reading stories with more hols in them.

Tal

HuliganRS · 06-18-2004, 08:27 AM

Regardless, it looks like a nice bust that is dated.

The story does sound a bit far fetched...

Bottom line is you have a very nice bust!

Rusty.

06-17-2004, 08:26 AM	#2
HuliganRS Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Illinois - U.S.A. Age: 45 Posts: 1,023	exiled, Welcome to the forum! Are there any markings on it? Knowing the Soviet system, it sure must have a few QA marks, manufacturing marks as well as the artists name... Rusty. __________________ "Be civil to all, sociable to many, familiar with few, friend to one, enemy to none." Benjamin Franklin ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Member #193

06-17-2004, 11:59 AM	#3
Tal Inbar Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Israel Age: 54 Posts: 2,302	I have the pillow of Lenin.........it is in my collection next the hat of Brezhnev.... Siriously, what proof can you provide regarding authenticity of the bust? Tal __________________ Under the banner of Marxism-Leninism, under the leadership of the Communist Party--forward to new victories in the construction of communism!

06-17-2004, 01:37 PM	#4
exiled New Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3	The mark is A. Mosvtormet, Mosvtormet which was and still is a big metal's company maybe A. Mosvtormet was the director of the company? Apart from that and the date I have no other information. I can understand peoples perception that hey it's another con, but it isn't I'm not here to sell this piece I am here to find information. Tal your question and I quote "Siriously, what proof can you provide regarding authenticity of the bust" Well you're asking me the same question that I originally asked, if I had proof of its authenticity I wouldn't have posted the question would I. Last edited by exiled; 06-17-2004 at 01:41 PM.

06-17-2004, 04:50 PM	#5
Tal Inbar Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Israel Age: 54 Posts: 2,302	exiled, Once again - what made you think this bust was Molotov's? Tal Possible means to validate your claim: 1. Signed document by Molotov regarding this bust; 2. " Molotov's family member; 3. Official document which states the presentation of the bust to Molotov Of course, each and every one of the above could be a fake. Meanwhile it is just a story, like MANY other ebay legends. __________________ Under the banner of Marxism-Leninism, under the leadership of the Communist Party--forward to new victories in the construction of communism! Last edited by Tal Inbar; 06-17-2004 at 05:09 PM.

06-18-2004, 04:27 AM	#7
new world Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: NYC, USA Posts: 1,086	As Tal said - there's no proof this belonged to Molotov and nothing on the bust identifies the owner. The writing contains name of the manufacturer and the date. William Last edited by new world; 06-18-2004 at 04:30 AM.

06-18-2004, 02:57 AM	#6
otlichnik Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Age: 55 Posts: 547	I think your best bet would be to go the art history route. There must be some source, either book or professor at a Russian university or art gallery who would know about this. Items like this would have been well known in the art community. Even an office of Christie's auction house. Shawn

06-18-2004, 06:13 AM	#8
exiled New Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3	Tal The bust was taken out of the Kremlin by a friend of Molotovs he also worked at the Kremlin. He later immigrated to Israel and left the bust with the present owner. It is difficult to prove and I believe a museum or auction house would be my best bet. Last edited by exiled; 06-18-2004 at 06:16 AM.

06-18-2004, 06:33 AM	#9
Tal Inbar Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Israel Age: 54 Posts: 2,302	The story sounds VERY uncreadible. Very. When this "Molotov's freind" imigrated to Israel? What proofs he has to back up the story? Did he presented his ID and permition to enter the Kremlin, from the time he claimed to work there? As for now, I find any "discussion" on the subject futile, and as I said before in this thread - a story, with NO facts what so ever to proove it. I for one will not take part in future remarks on this story, unless some VERY convincing facts will show up. I would rather eat Swiss chease than reading stories with more hols in them. Tal __________________ Under the banner of Marxism-Leninism, under the leadership of the Communist Party--forward to new victories in the construction of communism! Last edited by Tal Inbar; 06-18-2004 at 06:41 AM.

06-18-2004, 08:27 AM	#10
HuliganRS Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Illinois - U.S.A. Age: 45 Posts: 1,023	Regardless, it looks like a nice bust that is dated. The story does sound a bit far fetched... Bottom line is you have a very nice bust! Rusty. __________________ "Be civil to all, sociable to many, familiar with few, friend to one, enemy to none." Benjamin Franklin ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Member #193

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