Help to ID Soviet Shoulderboard

[OKP]

Originally Posted by willie777

First of all, Welcome to the forum, Prometheus!

The lettering on your shoulder boards can be latinized as OKP.
ГБ is latinized as GB.

This is from fellow forum member olitchnik's site:

"The KGB's Special Guards: The Separate Kremlin Regiment & Lenin's Tomb

The guard personnel of the KGB's Seperate Kremlin Regiment and guard personnel posted to Guard Post #1 (Lenin's Tomb) used slightly modified uniforms. Personnel with the Separate Kremlin Regiment used normal KGB state security uniforms as outlined above, however, enlisted personnel had slightly different shoulder boards. The royal blue parade and service boards had the cyrillic letters "OKP" on them in stead of the usual "GB". This stood for "Otdelenie Kremlinskoi Polk" or Separate Kremlin Regiment. (Some sources say "Osobiye Kremlinskoi Polk" or Special Kremlin Regiment.)"

"I know that it isn't the Kermlin Guards. that would have ГБ with gold strips on the edges."

Also from olitchnik's site:
"On the other hand the enlisted personnel assigned to guards Lenin's Tomb in Red Square used very different uniforms. The enlisted uniform was based on the KGB state security officer's parade uniform (in formation variation). Thus they wore the regular officer's sea green peaked hat, tunic, and breeches with gold officer's parade belt, black boots, and white gloves. This officer's uniform was then modified in a few ways:

-royal blue enlisted parade shoulder boards were used. These had "GB" (not "OKP") in yellow letters and were piped along the edges in yellow.

-royal blue enlisted sleeve patches were worn on both sleeves of the tunic.

-gold braid aglets (sleeve cords) were worn over the right shoulder."

Thus, one can conclude that these pogoni (shoulder boards) are of a private in the Seperate Kremlin Regiment. Also, GB boards are not used by the kremlin regiment, but lenin's tomb guards.

Also, a relevant thread from long ago:
http://www.soviet-awards.com/forum/s...html#post51611

Hi Willie777,thanks for quoting my tread (which didn't get much follow up unfortunately).
If Otlitchnik doesn't mind,I would like to add some changes to his article (and some changes as well regarding what Don Creamer says in his article "The Special Kremlin Regiment" in the Border Post Magazine issue).I had the opportunity to see quite a lot of pictures about the Lenin Mausoleum Honor Guard & The Kremlin Regiment and some russian newspapers articles as well.
In his article,Mr Creamer says that 3 types of shoulder boards were worn by the Kremlin Regiment troops : one with cyphers GB,one without cyphers and one with OKP cyphers.Well it's true but it has to be more detailed....
The sh. boards were indeed worn first without cyphers but for the period 1969 to 1973 or even 1975 (M-69 sh.boards).According to soviet military regulations,the shoulder boards are worn plain with the service dress.And metal cyphers are worn with the parade & walking out dresses.
In 1973,a prikaz (decree) institutes the shoulder boards with thermoglued cyphers (M-73 sh.boards).
Therefore,for the period 1973-75,it is not suprising to see Mausoleum guards uniforms with M-69 Sh.boards and others with M-73 ones....
From 1973 on,the cyphers GB are then worn on the sh.boards of all the KGB units,including the Kremlin Regiment and the Mausoleum guard (for the Mausoleum guards I noticed 3 different types of sh.boards worn,all with yellow piping along the edges).
In fact,the guard of the Mausoleum was not distinct from the Kremlin Regiment,it was performed by selected troops of the Kremlin Regiment (actually the 1st Cy of the regiment,the honor guard Cy,formed 01st July 1976 was responsible for protocole events).
The Kremlin Regiment was given the task to perform the guard at the Mausoleum from 1935 till 1993.
But then,will you say :"when were the sh.boards with OKP cyphers worn?"
Well I have developped my own hypothesis and frankly speaking,I think it makes quite sense....
For taking part in the coup in summer 1991,the KGB is disbanded on November 06th 1991.Then I think that it was decided the following :
It was not appropriate any more to wear the cypher representing an organ that had been disbanded.
Therefore,the cyphers OKP were worn by the Kremlin Regiment including the guard at the Mausoleum (there is photographic evidence of the wear).
On 26th December 1991,USSR ceases to exist.
21st September 1993 : dissolution of the Soviet Supreme
06 October 1993,the shift 03:00 PM to 04:00 PM will be the last one at the Mausoleum;it's definitely over.
First on 08th December 1997,will a decree institute the new POST NUMBER ONE at the Tomb of The Unknown Soldier in the Aleksander Gardens.

To conclude,I'll say that the OKP shoulder boards were worn from 1991 to 1993 (I have a pair dated 1992).These boards are in fact the last ones of the soviet era and among the first post soviet ones,being worn at the beginning of the Russian Federation...

[OKP]

Looks like I was right!!!Found out-thanks to a russian collegue- the Prikaz (decree) instituting the wear of OKP shoulder boards,dated 16 December 1991.Another mystery solved....
[IMG]http://img140.**********.us/img140/5769/prikazokp1991xx0.jpg[/IMG]

[Lapa]

OKP,

Interesting, it means that this ukaz was in force in all for 10 days!!!

Marc

[Lapa]

OKP,

That means that these boards were used by the Russian army, not by the Soviet one. Slight difference :D

Marc

[OKP]

I'd say that it was used by the soviet army and the russian army (The "Russian Armed Forces" were born first on 07.May 1992,when Boris Eltsine signed a decree creating the Russian Ministry of Defense):D

[Lapa]

Originally Posted by OKP

I'd say that it was used by the soviet army and the russian army (The "Russian Armed Forces" were born first on 07.May 1992,when Boris Eltsine signed a decree creating the Russian Ministry of Defense):D

Yes, but the Soviet Union ceased to exist on 26 December 1991. So, whatever way you look at it, they were not used by the Soviet Union, but by the Russian Federation (which at that time retained it official title as RSFSR).

Marc

[HuliganRS]

Fun thread!

I just picked up my OKP uniform...

[OKP]

Originally Posted by HuliganRS

Fun thread!

I just picked up my OKP uniform...

Nice!Just one question btw : do the shoulder boards have a cloth layer underneath (like on the M-1973 reguilation ones) or not please?

Some update:
the OKP shoulder boards went in use round mid-1992 and were used simultaneously with the GB boards before replacing them totally....

[Will]

Originally Posted by Lapa

Yes, but the Soviet Union ceased to exist on 26 December 1991. So, whatever way you look at it, they were not used by the Soviet Union, but by the Russian Federation (which at that time retained it official title as RSFSR).

Marc

Marc....
If the decree for the boards was dated 16 December, would not these have technically been "Soviet" boards for the remaining 10 day existence of the Soviet Union?

[Lapa]

Will,

Technically, they would but... it is highly unlikely that those boards would be produced, distributed and then worn in that 10-day period.

Marc