Returned Soviet Awards: Where Are They Now?

[GeoKeith]

Question: Does anyone know what happens to Soviet military orders that were returned to the government upon death of the recipient? Is there a museum located somewhere in Russia with the returned Orders on display? In fact, is there a WWII military awards museum in Russia?

If yes, I would like to know about it as I have an interest in visiting it. I have been to the Moscow museum, but did not see many Soviet orders on display.

Any information on this subject would be appreciated.

[Kirchgoens]

So many recipients would have lost their awards during the purges of the mid/late 30's, including many belonging to the purgers themselves (many early ORS's and OBH's went to these nice guys, along with a few OL's and ORB's). I wonder where all these low serial-numbered awards ended up when their recipients were stripped of rank/position, and often sent to the gulags or simply shot.

Also, I think many awards had to go back to the state by statute? The ORS was among those I believe (but I'm not sure). I'm sure many slipped through the cracks, but the rest of them must have been collected somewhere. I wonder if these were pushed into the market like so much military hardware in the early 90's. Any one have any ideas on this?

...Brian

[Lapa]

Guys,

All orders and medals were returned to the State until 1977, with the exception of the Order of the Patriotic War (all classes) that families could keep as a memento of the deceased veteran. Awards were sent to Gokhan, the state service in charge of keeping all valuables. As far as we can tell, they all should still be there.

OMDs can be seen in almost every museum in the former Soviet Union; some of them have more, some of them have less. If you want to see a whole lot of them, try the Central Museum of the Armed Forces in Moscow, the Navy Museum in St Petersburg, or the newly opened Museum of Decorations at the Constantine Palace (now serving as presidential palace) in suburban St Petersburg.

Marc

[GeoKeith]

MArc,

There are serious collectors in Russian now, and both they and the government see these objects as part of their national heritage. Old Soviet law required the return of these orders, as you stated. Do you know if the laws have changed now? If a Russian citizen purchases such an order on the western market (and I am told they do so...), can they legally re-import them? And keep them? This whole story of Soviet military awards, their associated histories, and what has happened to them is fascinating to me...

[LavricCat]

Originally Posted by GeoKeith

Question: Does anyone know what happens to Soviet military orders that were returned to the government upon death of the recipient?

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I've read about Order of Red Banner #3: it was awarded to Feodor Mironov.Then Mironov was executed(he was an enemy of the People). His Order was awarded to Comrade Stalin.
Again,- this is from questionable source of information.

[Lapa]

Originally Posted by GeoKeith

MArc,

There are serious collectors in Russian now, and both they and the government see these objects as part of their national heritage. Old Soviet law required the return of these orders, as you stated. Do you know if the laws have changed now? If a Russian citizen purchases such an order on the western market (and I am told they do so...), can they legally re-import them? And keep them? This whole story of Soviet military awards, their associated histories, and what has happened to them is fascinating to me...

Keith,

The law was changed in 1977. Today, things are still the same as then: sale, purchase, loan, gift of Soviet OMD is punishable (czarist awards can be officially bought and sold without problem). So, in short, the recipient can quietly hold his awards, anybody else officially cannot.
In Russia, OMD are bought and sold "quietly" as any law enforcement official could prosecute you for that. Russians buy overseas and take the goodies back home, but their importation is not done legally, as they could be confiscated by Customs upon entry into Russia.

Marc

Originally Posted by LavricCat

####################
I've read about Order of Red Banner #3: it was awarded to Feodor Mironov.Then Mironov was executed(he was an enemy of the People). His Order was awarded to Comrade Stalin.
Again,- this is from questionable source of information.

LavricCat,

Eto skazka!

Marc

[jefflgarrison]

So basically, the only person that can legally collect orders and medals of the former Soviet Union is "the Soviet Union".

[slava1stclass]

Gents,

Some nice images of holdings in the Russian Federation's State Archives Vault. Note that the slips of paper under each order/decoration reference the specimen's name, weight, and serial number among other things.

These items represent orders/decorations that were either: 1) awarded and never presented since the recipient could not be located and/or was MIA/KIA or 2) returned to the State Archives upon the recipient's death (until the point in time that policy was altered - 1977 I believe).

Regards,

slava1stclass

[slava1stclass]

Gents,

Orders of Lenin, U.S. gold dollars from the late 1890s/early 1900s and the world's largest gold nugget.

Regards,

slava1stclass

[slava1stclass]

Gents,

Here is another nice item from the Russian State Depository for Precious Metals' collection.

Regards,

slava1stclass