Marshal of USSR M/69 parade visor cap - copy/fake?

[Lapa]

Doug,

The thread is clearly not what it should be!

Marc

[DougD]

Marc,

The cap is not from me, so I have never been able to have it in my hands, but I do not feel 100% comfortable saying its a fake at this point. I have doubts, but I am not willing to go as far as you are at this point. There is an E seller right now from the Moscow area that is selling similar caps; Marshal and Admiral of the Fleet of the USSR; if repro, probably from the same source.

It's very similar to the Doubledecker uniform items...I did not like many of the items they had in photos, but I waited until I could actually examine some of their uniforms to draw firm conclusions; this is sometimes not necessary as some of the items from Ukraine (see fakes thread) are so bad as to not require a hands on. We all set our own criteria.

DougD

[charlet]

in France we call that "a nordmen answer": maybe yes, maybe not... ;)

you're right about the very high peak Doug. I don't feel comfortable about the gold thread, I find it too big. Would it be a possible criteria, almost if we look at Patrick's pictures?

[Lapa]

Guys,

Has ANYBODY ever seen a genuine Marshal cap WITHOUT bullion thread ribs? I for one have not, either in person or in museums.

Marc

[DougD]

The buttons are dated 1988, so that only means they were produced then...hat was probably at least 1 -2 years later, so we are looking at a cap from 1989-1991....I am not sure how many Marshals caps "we" have seen from that time period that we can compare this to. I would say in general we have no idea what materials were used at the very end of the USSR, perhaps counter to regulations and perhaps counter to what was made before. It might very well be a parts hat, put together with leftover materials after the fall of the USSR (what I am tending to now).

For some, "pronouncing" this cap fake is a major issue. I have some issues with it, mostly overall quality and the crazy high peak. The sweat diamond also concerns me, as the later era marshals and generals caps I have had in have not had this shape, rather they have the rounded one (though with same stamp)...again, leftover liner just thrown in and stamped? Maybe.

However, I am not willing to say its an outright fake.

If the cap were offered to me from a new source, I would decline. If it were from one of my regular sources i would ask to see it in hand first before I decided. That's it, thats my call.

I am not sure why this is a major issue here....each is entitled to his own threshold in what THEY consider real and fake...and, even then, it only applies to them...just because someone declares an item fake (or real for that matter) does not make it so anywhere else other than in that persons mind.

DougD