12-28-2005, 03:20 PM
dannybou Wrote:Paul
On another well known reputable dealer's site, there is a Halhingol badge for sale, just like mine. The screwnut appears to be just like mine. It is advertised as being an original screwnut. If you want the dealer's website, I can PM it to you.
Danny,
That dealer you PMed me, from what I've read and heard here and there, doesn't seem to me as trustworthy as you say, as if my memory isn't playing tricks on me I believe he already had one or two suspicious pieces for sale on his site, which I think were even discussed here on the Forum.
Anyway, the fact he has that piece for sale doesn't guarantee 100% that the whole thing is 100% authentic.
On the other hand, the fact that Alexei guarantees that your Badge is authentic, that is of course completely different!
Anyway, can you please confirm if this is the Badge that Alexei describes on his site as: "... "flat back" reverse, screwplate is not original, but old, has a very small enamel chip at 8 o'clock (hardly noticeable), very minor wear traces, XF+ condition... "
Well, anyway I'm glad you're happy with it, after all that's what counts.
dannybou Wrote:Guys
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The badge weighs 15.5gr and measures 42.5mm from the flag pole to the bottom of the badge. The screwnut weighs in at 6.8gr and measures 25mm.
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Danny,
Comparing weight and measures of your Badge with my flat-reverse Badge:
My flat-reverse Badge weights 16,15gr (without the screwnut)
The screwnut alone weights 3,15gr
The Badge measures 42,68mm from the flag pole to the bottom of the Badge (approximately to the letter H, before the I)
The diameter of the Badge, from side to side (left-right) is 37,45mm
The diameter of the screwnut alone is 18,34mm
Danny, Alexei, Desantnik, Jan, all involved on this superb debate:
I've sent both pics of Danny's Badge (the two scans and the two digital camera pictures) to a Mongolian friend of mine, the best expert I know about Mongolian awards.
I'm pasting below part of his reply with his opinions from the pics posted here by Danny:
"[COLOR="Blue"]Hi Dolf,
I examined the fotos. I think the badges are genuine. You are right about the suspissious color of the medals.
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Halhingol medals are quite fragile and tend to go broken quite quickly.
Mostly the red enamel is very fragile. I know people from the black market who repair the damage by putting nail polish, some quite well. But it is easy to identify by pinching it with the needle. The enamel is very hard material. The nail polish even after getting hard is soft enough to be pinced by a needle.
Recently, I saw a Halhingol medal repaired by the badge company in Mongolia.
They remove all the enamel from the medal and put new enamel.
Unfortunately, they do not have old-style so called hot enamel. They have only "cold" enamel. One of Halhingols in your foto looks very artificial. I am sure it was repaired in the badge factory.
The metal part is genuine.
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Your Halhingol is 100 percent genuine and the screwnut is the genuine
of Halhingol.
The other two Monetny dvor screwnuts are genuine, but not from Halhingol.
They are from M 45.1, best herder badge. J 02. Half silver.
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My friend uses the plural (BadgeS, ScrewnutS, etc) because I guess he didn't clearly understand that all four pictures posted by Danny were from the same piece.
At the end when he says that the screwnut on Danny's Badge is from M 45.1, he refers to Herfurth Catalogue 4th edition, and J 02 is a reference to Dr. Battushig's book.
Anyway, his opinions match my own opinions about this particular piece, as mentioned before.
So I'm very glad I've learned so much (even thought I've still much more to learn and so far I only know the visible head of the iceberg on this matter!) and made such progress since I joined the Forum, with the help of all Forum experts and other members, and thanks to this kind of serious debate.
Again thank you very much to all involved on this very interesting discussion.
Best,
Dolf
