Suspensions, Ribbons, Ribbon Bars And Order Of Precedence.

[Tal Inbar]

Excellent information, Mahdi, and congratulations on becoming a moderator. One more section to you and you will become a "moderator Cavalier"....

What about mixing Soviet ribbons with post 1991 Russian ribbons? If, for example, one have the order of Lenin from the USSR and the highest post 1991 Russian order - which is put higher on the ribbon bar?

Do anyone got a post 1991 order/medal as a replacement for a Soviet one (like the order of freindship between peoples, the order of the badge of honour etc.)?

Tal

[Mahdi]

Thanks Tal, I'll do my best and work with Art to make this as great as it could be!

To answer your question about awards of the Russian Federation and the Soviet Union. In a nutshell, you can consider the Soviet awards just like "foreign" awards. So Russian Federation awards go first, regardless of rank, then come Soviet awards in the order that I mentioned before, and finally come awards of other governments (unless the veteran has Imperial Russia? I don't think there exists a person with awards from Imperial Russia, USSR, and then the Russian Federation :D).

I roughly translated article 22 in the legislative document concerning the awards of the Russian Federation, which has to do with this issue:

"Article 22: If the awardee was given awards from the Russian and the USSR, the awards of the Russian Federation should preceed the awards of the USSR.

If the awarde has orders, medals, and excellence badges for special titles of the Russian Federation, the USSR, and foreign governments, the orders, medals, and badges of the foreign governments should be below the awards of the Russian Federation and the USSR."

As for your second question, I guess I am a little unclear about what you're asking for - do you mean a replacement for a Soviet award that got lost (ie, a duplicate) or do you mean an award that the veteran was supposed to receive but was never given for some reason? If you are referring to duplicates, then as far as I know, the Russian government still provided duplicates for the Soviet order instead of giving the Russian equivalent. But if the person simply did not receive the order, I am not sure wat they would be given - I would guess they still would get the Soviet award. I am making this guess based on the two documents that I posted in the "Paper Items" forum...

Hope this helps!

Oh, in case your next question concerns the order of the awards of the Russian Federation, here is what I can tell:

Order of St. Andrew
Order "For Service to the Fatherland"
Order of Zhukov
Order of Courage
Order "For Military Services"
Order "For Naval Services"
Order of Honor
Order of Friendship
"Gold Star" medal for Hero of the Russian Federation
Medal of the order "For Service to the Fatherland"
Medal "For Bravery"
Medal "For Defender of Free Russia"
Medal "For Saving Life"
Medal of Suvorov
Medal of Ushakov
Medal of Nesterov
Medal "For Excellence in Protecting State Borders"
Medal "For Excellence in Protecting Public Order"
Commemorative Medal "50 Years of Victory in WWII 1941-1945"
Medal of Zhukov
Commemorative Medal "300 Years of the Russian Fleet"
Medal "In Memory of Moscow's 850th Anniversary"
Medal of Pushkin
Commemorative Medal "100 Years of the Trans-Siberian Railway"
Excellence Badge "For Irreproachable Service"

This is a visual guide that shows the order of precedence of ribbon bars for Soviet orders and medals... Of course, no such group exists; this is just a "fantasy" group. (Yes, sometimes I have too much time on my hands so I spend it on making things like this)

[Tal Inbar]

EXCELENT!!!!!!!

I think the books we are using should have a visual guide like this!

Tal:)

[Nota Bene]

Gentlemen,

Owner of these two didn't want his ribbons to get dirty, so he put them into plastic. I think it's cool.

Alexei

[Ed_Haynes]

I have seen other Warsaw Pact groups (mostly Bulgarian, I think) where the ribbons were in fact replaced by colored plastic. Does this happen with Soviet awards as well?

Ed Haynes

[Nota Bene]

Ed,

I have seen once a home made multisectional suspnsion with nicely drawn paper ribbons covered with plastic. Unfortunately I don't have a scan of it :(

Alexei

[Christophe]

I'm usually not collecting "Fruit salads" or bars, but got this modest one.

As I am not a specialist, I take the opportunity to ask for comments of the experts of the Forum...

It is a cloth ribbons bar on cloth backing (dark green, see pic.).

Does it has to be considered as a veteran bar ? or a regulation bar ? What makes the difference ? (excuse this basic question).

Is it the absence of the "Medal 30 Years of Victory in GPW" (1975), and the presence of the "Medal for 60 Years of the Armed Forces" (1978) normal ?

Can you advise me on a good book or documentation (in plus of the estimated content of the Forum) that could help me in becoming an expert - vast programme !!! :p

Signification or origin of this green back clothing ?

"Does it has to be considered as a veteran bar ? or a regulation bar ? What makes the difference ? (excuse this basic question).

Is it the absence of the "Medal 30 Years of Victory in GPW" (1975), and the presence of the "Medal for 60 Years of the Armed Forces" (1978) normal ?

Any specific comment ?"

In advance, many thanks.

Cheers.

Ch.

[sovvisor]

Hi
I think that this man probobly was a private in the war if he was in it. By the ribbons I would say that he was an officer in the sixties an seventies. Forget me if my memory fails me but I think I saw the order of the red star and order for meritios service to the armed forces of the ussr. The rest is jubelee medal from sixties and further on. There are also some medal for long service all three classes. The green cloth I have nothing to say about. I have seen many kinds of backings for medalribbons. I think it´s a very nice ribbon group theat should be on an service uniform for a lower officer perhaps a major or in KGB an colonel. Nice one and the order of the ribbons says it´s ok and not an later " put on what you find at home" ribbon group.
Please check Dietrich Herfurth " Sowjetische Auszeichnungen 1918-1991 third edition from 1999.
Hope this helped you a little.
Best

[Christophe]

Sovvisor,

You said "Hope this helped you a little"... More than this; you bring light in a tunnel !! And the exercise is not a simple one !!

Many thanks for your help and time. I appreciate a lot !!

Cheers.

Ch.

PS : The second ribbon is the one of the Order for Service to the Motherland - 3rd Class; I think it is the one you mentioned.

[Dave]

Christophe-

The grouping could have very well been made in East Germany, or using E. German uniform cloth (as I recall, they had a uniform that was about this color...) That's what it appears to be... Foreign uniform cloth of some sort, basically the first thing the guy could get his hands on to make a backing for the ribbons! :)

I have a US set of ribbons made in Berlin with the same color backing cloth on them, and that's where that cloth came from.

--Dave